Re: OFF-TOPIC Re: An information pirate attempts to develop oppor tunities!

[David Thorburn <thorburn@CONL.NET>]

I am sure that I don't like your tone Paul.

Your naivite is understandable.

When you are laid off so that your company can replace
you with outsourced resources maybe your perspective
will change.

D.

----- Original Message -----
From: "O'riordan, Paul (EI05)" <Paul.O'riordan@HONEYWELL.COM>
To: <SQR-USERS@list.iex.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 5:08 AM
Subject: Re: OFF-TOPIC Re: An information pirate attempts to develop oppor
tunities!


> I'm not too sure that I like the tone of this string. It could be almost
> construed as imflammatory and racial and cultural predjudice.
> 1. you are assuming that everyone on the list is American or working there
> and everyone else is irrelevant. How nice of you to accept the H1Bs as
> people.
> 2. You are also forgetting that these Outsourcing companies have in the
main
> been set up by Corporate America as a means of expanding the Global
economy
> and yes - getting cheaper labour.
> 3. Outsourcing occurs in almost every country in the world so I would like
> you to expand on how these places are all known to be Havens of espionage
> and piracy?
> I work for a multinational US based company with plants in over 100
> countries where yes - they do have the audacity to employ  local talent -
> and we even in Ireland are a lot cheaper than the US alternative but we
also
> are losing out to the rise in "competition" from Asia - within our own
> company, but welcome to planet earth. You wanted capitalism and all of the
> world markets opened up? Well the traffic goes both ways and you have to
> accept it. We actually market ourselves as supplying quality product as
> programmers, which is in effect cheaper in the long run to use, compared
to
> using cheaper, mass-produced work which needs constant attention, over
runs
> budget and deadlines and then fails to work. $80 p/hour for 8 hours is
> cheaper than $40 and hour for something that takes twice as long to
develop,
> doesn't work, is not what the customer wanted and in the end, people like
us
> get the contract to "fix" the bugs and make it work.
> I know the point you are making but please think a little bit less
> parochially - especially when using a global mailing list.
>         Regards,
>                 Paul
>
>
> Honeywell
>
> Paul O'Riordan                  Honeywell Application Services
> Application Developer           Industrial Park, Cork Road
> PeopleSoft Applications,                Waterford Ireland
>
>                                                         +353-51-309856
> Direct
>                                 +353-51-309821 Fax
>                                 +353-87-9083244 Mobile
> mailto:Paul.O'Riordan@honeywell.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sam Spritzer [mailto:teknogeek9@YAHOO.COM]
> Sent: 02 October 2002 12:29
> To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> Subject: OFF-TOPIC Re: An information pirate attempts to develop
> opportunities!
>
>
> Generally speaking, this does not belong here but I think some degree of
> flexibility should be allowed to post off topic discussions which can have
a
> dramatic impact on our ability to be an SQRer.  For those of you who are
not
> interested, please stop here and delete this.  I have added OFF-TOPIC to
the
> subject line for this reason.
>
> I agree with David.  The proliferation of off-shore outsourcing has
exploded
> over the last year.  My own personal experience can testify to that both
> from
> an employed and unemployed perspective.  This article seems to best
address
> the
> issue:
> http://www.bayarea.com/mld/siliconvalley/4154071.htm
>
> I am not sure if the feds are doing anything but keep in mind, the
offshore
> companies have a headstart - they have formed American subsidiaries which
> essentially serve as nothing more than conduits to the actual transaction.
>
> I have nothing against those who work for offshore companies and I have
> worked
> alongside several.  The biggest barrier, of course, is language and
culture.
> My only concern is my own livelihood as an SQRer.  But, I also think it is
a
> two-edged sword.  Given today's economy and changing times, I think
> contracted
> rates of $75 or more (contracting firms are excluded) is considered
> excessive.
> The laws of supply and demand require we adjust accordingly.
Unfortunately,
> many folks simply fail to see that hence, they are priced out of the
market.
>
> At this point, I am not doing anything about it.  Maybe I should...or
maybe
> this discussion can evolve into a more positive voice which will give more
> power to deal with the issue.  Who knows...lets see where this leads.
>
> Regards,
> Sam
>
>
> --- David Thorburn <thorburn@CONL.NET> wrote:
> > To the list:
> >
> > This SPAM from an offshore outsourcing pirate, Mr. Reddy, arrived in my
> > email today.
> >
> > I just wanted to send this to the list, and selected media to make sure
> that
> > other
> > American IT Professionals are aware that people like this, who represent
> > offshore
> > development centers full of hordes of slaves, working in countries where
> > copyright and
> > patent laws are not respected, and, where most toil in slave programming
> > mills for
> > little more than their kids make rolling cigarettes are after your jobs
> and
> > career.
> >
> > Their aim is to put us out of business and replace us with their IT
> slaves.
> >
> > At least the imported H1B's spend money and pay taxes while they are
here!
> >
> > H1B's are people, but foreign outsourcers are pirates!
> >
> > Write your elected officials and demand that they put a stop to offshore
> > outsourcing now!
> >
> > Do you want your credit, personnel, financial, and medical information
> being
> > programmed, stored,
> > copied, communicated, and manipulated by these pirates and by their
slaves
> > in foreign countries?
> >
> > How can we expect our governments laws, which are meant to protect us,
to
> > possibly
> > be enforced in these foreign counties known to be havens for espionage
and
> > piracy?
> >
> > The time to act is now.
> >
> > Be watchful and aware of the threat to your career, your credit rating,
> and
> > your privacy.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > David
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Elite Outsource International, Inc" <reddys@eliteoutsource.com>
> > To: <reddys@eliteoutsource.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 7:27 PM
> > Subject: Introducing - Elite Outsource International, Inc
> >
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > This is Srinivas Reddy from Elite Outsource International, Inc. I am
> > writing
> > > this letter to introduce myself and Elite's services of Software
> > > Development,
> > > Staff Augmentation (Consulting & Staffing), Project Management
> > > (On Site & Off Shore) and outsourcing services, that we offer in the
> > > Information Technology Industry.
> > >
> > > Please note that, I am well aware of the current market situation and
my
> > > goal is to better utilize this quiet time to get to know each other
and
> > > establish a mutual business understanding, that can be fruitful and
> > > beneficial to both our firms, towards your any and all future needs in
> the
> > > IT Discipline.
> > >
> > > I take this opportunity to bring to your attention of Elite Outsource
> > > International, Inc. A company that provides technology-driven services
> > > dedicated to helping its customers deploy, maximize, and manage
> > Information
> > > Systems Solutions. Elite Outsource International, Inc is one of
> America's
> > > fastest growing and dependable Private Company. Learn more about Elite
> > > Outsource International at www.eliteoutsource.com.
> > >
> > > I look forward to establishing a mutually beneficial relation between
> us.
> > I
> > > request you to contact me anytime without hesitation for any and all
> needs
> > > you come across in IT Industry.
> > >
> > > Sincerely,
> > >
> > >
> > > Srinivas Reddy
> > > General Manager.
> > >
> > > Elite Outsource International, Inc
> > > Reinforcing Excellence
> > >
> > > 3-14, Fox Run Drive,
> > > Plainsboro,
> > > New Jersey - 08536
> > > www.eliteoutsource.com
> > >
> > > Phone: 609-716-7604
> > > Fax:   609-716-4911
> > >
> > >
> > > Under Bill s.1618 Title III passed by the 105th U.S.Congress this mail
> > > cannot be considered
> > > Spam as long as we include contact information and a remove link for
> > removal
> > > from our mailing
> > > list. To be removed from our mailing list reply to
> > > mailto:reddys@eliteoutsource.com?Subject=Remove
> > > with 'REMOVE' in the subject heading and your email address in the
body.
> > > Include complete address
> > > and/or domain/aliases to be removed. If you still get the mails,
please
> > call
> > > us at the numbers given
> > > above.
> > >
> > >
>
>
> =====
> ************************************************************
> "In the beginning, there was something...which exploded yet, they find
> nothing."
>
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