Re: Purpose of this list

[Peter Clark <PGCLARK@VAC-ACC.GC.CA>]

Has anyone else noticed that when these off-topic, name calling storms occur, 
it seems that Mr. Thorburn is always in the eye of the hurricane?

Can we get back to business on this INTERNATIONAL SQR mail list. As others have 
noted, there are more appropriate forums for political and American-centric 
issues.

>>> David Thorburn <thorburn@CONL.NET> 2002/10/02 8:02:12 pm >>>
To Allen the can't-program, whiney, wimp, name caller...

Why don't you shut the $%^## up or say that to my face you whiney
liberal yap!

I have every right to express my opinion.  SQR is a programming
language and this forum is for programmers, not touchy feely
mealy-mouthed liberals like you.

I make my living programming as do others out here who are
concerned about the the effect of offshore piracy on our careers.

What's the matter, am I getting in the way of your effort to get
others to do your work for you!

D.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Allen Cunningham" <allen.cunningham@SONOMA.EDU>
To: <SQR-USERS@list.iex.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 8:04 AM
Subject: Re: Purpose of this list


> I agree Amy, there's just a handful of these idiots like him who have
> destroyed this list.
>
> ac
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion of SQR, Brio Software's database reporting language
> [mailto:SQR-USERS@list.iex.net]On Behalf Of Christenson, Amy
> Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 6:26 AM
> To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
>
>
> Why don't you run for professional help and in the meantime stop abusing
> this forum.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Thorburn [mailto:thorburn@CONL.NET]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 6:25 PM
> To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
>
>
> perfect example of an unfocused liberal PC wishy washy response to a very
> serious
> situation.
>
> Why don't you run for President?
>
> <lol>
>
> D.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Christenson, Amy" <amy.christenson@ATTWS.COM>
> To: <SQR-USERS@list.iex.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 1:22 PM
> Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
>
>
> > I do; If you need help with PeopleSoft specific questions in the future,
> > please join us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/peoplesoft-fans . I
belong
> > to both groups but move back and forth depending on my question. That
way
> > you can avoid at least a portion of this in the future.
> >
> > Amy
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Aaron M. Reiff [mailto:aaron.reiff@MAIL.RGSTR.WISC.EDU]
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 4:03 PM
> > To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> > Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
> >
> >
> > Perhaps we should all move on.  All points seems to have been expressed,
> > aired and otherwise worn-out.
> >
> > Does anyone have anything productive and non-threatening to say
regarding
> > this issue before we return to the business at hand?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Discussion of SQR, Brio Software's database reporting language
> > [mailto:SQR-USERS@list.iex.net]On Behalf Of Allen Cunningham
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 2:37 PM
> > To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> > Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
> >
> >
> > Chris - I certainly don't appreciate being lectured and scolded by you,
> and
> > your patronizing little suggestion to take a PeopleTools class. If your
> > having a bad day, find a better way to deal with it than venting on this
> > board. This was posted late Fri afternoon, it certainly didn't generate
a
> > lot of 'noise' that you say you are so worried about. If you don't like
a
> > posting, ignore it.
> >
> > ac
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Discussion of SQR, Brio Software's database reporting language
> > [mailto:SQR-USERS@list.iex.net]On Behalf Of Chris Bennett
> > Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 4:15 PM
> > To: SQR-USERS@list.iex.net
> > Subject: Re: Purpose of this list
> >
> >
> > Ken,
> >
> > That's an interesting question.  Just for clarification let me point out
> > that my primary concern was the potential trouble I foresaw Allen
getting
> > into if he tries to accomplish his goals by getting "step by step"
> > instructions from this list.  I thought it was a very valid and
hopefully
> > helpful answer to suggest that a class might be in his best interest.
> >
> > However, it is true that I was also concerned about the signal/noise
ratio
> > of this list, and I took the opportunity to also suggest that perhaps
not
> > everyone on the list would like to read a question and answer about
basic
> > PeopleTools (please note, however, that even after I said his post was
> > off-topic and that he would be better served by taking a class, that I
> > still answered the question).
> >
> > Anyway, to attempt to answer your question...
> >
> > According the the mailing list "hints and guidelines"
> > (http://www.sqrug.org/sqr-users/sqr-users-hints.html), the only sections
> > that directly refer to "etiquette" are the following:
> >
> > 1) "keep in mind that over 500 people will receive your message, and
that
> > it will appear in the list archives. Try to keep your messages on-topic
> > and relatively short. Consider sending your message directly to
particular
> > people if it won't interest many of the list's subscribers."
> >
> > 2) "Please do not post job announcements on the sqr-users list, but use
> > the sqr-jobs list instead. (See Related Mailing Lists for more
information
> > on this list.) A large number of sqr-users subscribers do not want to
> > receive job announcements (for various reasons) and such posts tend to
> > cause a lot of disruption of the discussion on the list."
> >
> > One could also read section 4.2 "Posting a Message" as strongly implying
> > that messages posted here should relate specifically to SQR.
> >
> > Aside from this, I don't know what the "position" here is any more than
> > you do (and as I'll explain below, to some extent it really doesn't
> > matter), but I'll offer up my opinions.
> >
> > I'll start with two assumptions.  These may be debatable, but I'll throw
> > them out as a starting point:
> >
> > 1) Most people on this list are (more or less) well paid professionals
> >
> > 2) If there is too much noise the "gurus" that monitor this list will
lose
> > interest and leave.
> >
> > Given these assumptions, I have the following opinions:
> >
> > I don't want to be used as someone else's gopher for basic reference
> > materials, and I suspect that other people on this list would rather not
> > be used for that purpose either.  While I enjoy helping someone who
truly
> > has a difficult or unusual problem, doing other people's work for them
> > goes beyond the call of duty.  Time is, indeed, of the essence for many
of
> > us, as you say.  But why would one person's time be more important than
> > mine?
> >
> > I also rely on this list as a resource to help out with any big problems
I
> > might run into, so I'm glad there are some very skilled and
knowledgeable
> > people that monitor this list.  I would be really disappointed to see
them
> > leave because this list degenerated into some sort of off-topic "how to
> > program"  tutorial group.
> >
> > This list is not moderated, so it is neither democratic (moderator
chosen
> > by vote) nor totalitarian (moderator is the list admin, Ray Ontko).
> > Anarchy seems more accurate.  As such, anyone can really post whatever
> > they want, and we each make our own decision as to whether it is worth
> > sticking around based on our own needs.  We can all decide as a group
that
> > job posting are taboo, but we know full well that some people will still
> > post them anyway.
> >
> > So all I can say is this:  I would prefer that we stay generally on
topic.
> > And I would prefer that we not be deluged with trivial questions that
are
> > asked just to save someone else's time at the expense of my time.  But
> > these are my preferences based on my needs.  If you or anyone else feels
> > that it would be a good idea to encourage people to post off-topic or
> > trivial questions, just consider what long-term utility you will be
> > getting from this list.
> >
> > There's probably no point to debating this.  Its not as if any decision
> > would be binding, and this really could just be considered more "noise"
> > on the list anyway.  Each person can make up their own mind and do as
they
> > wish.  Personally, I'm not going to whine about every post that goes
> > off-topic or asks something really trivial, nor will I send nasty notes
to
> > people who post jobs here.  Its not worth it and doesn't help in any
case.
> > But now and then I think its worthwhile to point out that this list is
> > only as useful as we make it.
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > On Mon, 30 Sep 2002, Ken Boettger wrote:
> >
> > > Chris,
> > >
> > > I am not certain I agree with this precept. It is a controversial one
> and
> > a common one, I know. But I wonder if it is an appropriate view. I quess
I
> > am a proponent of the "there is no stupid or silly questions" and that
> > forums are a place of learning.
> > >
> > > In addition, I have been in IT for 15 years and work with many
languages
> > and tools.  It is very hard to keep everything straight. Many times I
will
> > go to a list to get an answer to a simple issue that I cannot recall the
> > answer too. Yes, the answer is in the FAQ or in the manuals. And I think
> > they should be encouraged, but not enforced. The reason being that time
is
> > of the essence for many of us.  On many occassions (both in the public
and
> > private sector), I will post a question and then proceed with something
> else
> > until a response comes back.   From a statistical point of view, it
might
> > take me 5 or 10 minutes to find and read through a FAQ or manual before
I
> > find an anwser (if I can even remember where the manual is - or who
> borrowed
> > it last). Using a forum or list, I maybe type a concise question for 30
> > seconds, then spend another minute reading the responses - the point
here
> > being that a five fold increase in efficiency is significant from a
> > temporal, financial and pro!
> > fe!
> > > ssional point of view.
> > >
> > > My question is, what is the position here?  I believe in democracy and
> > will go either way. But I have on many occasions posted simple questions
> to
> > this list. If such questions are not welcome, I will stop using this
forum
> > in that regard.  And maybe we should consider an additional forum that
> > subscribes to a more open view including novice type questions?  There
is
> a
> > definitely a need for such a forum.
> > >
> > > -Ken
> > >
> > > Ken Boettger
> > > boettgek@cwu.edu
> > > http://www.cwu.edu/~boettgek
> > > x2944
> >
>